New PowerSpec G464 - issues with post

Tom_CAT

Hello,
The system works great most of the time, however, I do notice that sometimes upon a cold boot, the system hangs and no signal is sent to the screen.  The fans and lights turn on (I don't know the colors on the MOBO), but there is no signal to the screen.   1 or at worst 2 hard restarts seems resolve the issue, but I would like the system be more stable considering it is brand new and I don't think hard starts are especially healthy.

All drivers are up to date.  Happy to send along log files if helpful.  I tried to upload the admin event logs if helpful, there seems to be some warning and errors there, but file format wasn't allowed.
Thanks in advance!
-Tom

PowerSpec_MikeW

Greetings,

Please download and install CPU-Z. When you're able, please provide us with screenshots of the Memory and SPD tabs.

Tom_CAT

Hey @TSMikeW
Screenshots attached.   Let me know what you think!

PowerSpec_MikeW

@Tom_CAT

You're running on the XMP profile. Lets try to rule out a few things. Test another outlet, different power cable. Though a lot of time cold boot issues come down to unstable RAM. We could reduce the frequency to test, however this would be a work around. If that works we'll need to replace the RAM. I'd would step it down to 3200 and see if the cold boot issue remains.

Tom_CAT

@TSMikeW
Hey Mike - Ok, So I finally ran into the issue again this morning.   I would say it's about 1 in 10/15 times the issue occurs.  I do see the MOBO light go to orange and it hangs.   Never turns over to green.    
I just went into the BIOS and changed the DOCP setting to "Auto" as opposed to the higher performance setting, not sure how to screenshot a BIOS.....   It appears my ram is now clocking in at 2400 per memory in Task Manager.  Although I still see the CPUZ at XMP 2.0.   Did I do this correctly?    
I'll try to test it a bunch over the next few days to see if it is more stable.   But how big of an issue is an error that occurs every 10 or 15 boots, is there any damage being done to the computer from a cold restart?    Are there long term implications where the RAM is likely to fail sooner an I'll be outside my Powerspec 1 year warranty?

PowerSpec_MikeW

@Tom_CAT
Motherboard is hanging on initialization. Having to shut it down should not cause any long term damage, but this is an issue we do need to address. If you could also check the debug LED's on the top right and let me know what they're indicating. I'd assume it's hanging on CPU/DRAM.

Regarding the RAM, not quite. You're going to see the actual speed on CPU-Z under memory, and the SPD profiles under SPD. These are profiles that are stored, not necessarily loaded. So it sounds like by setting XMP to Auto, it didn't load a profile at all and trained to the 2400Mhz JEDEC profile that was on the stick. Verify on the memory tab. It's still a good test to see if it's stable. Let us know what your results are.

Tom_CAT

@TSMikeW
Thank you sir.
I'll let you know, it seems stable right now.  But the issue is that it takes quite a few restarts to catch the issue.   Right now I'm assuming i need to wait a couple hours between tests, ie "Cold reboot".   The downside there being it takes a while to test.   Or should I just shut down and boot the machine10 - 20 times to see if I get the issue?   That would obviously be much faster.....

PowerSpec_MikeW

@Tom_CAT

You can try testing it like that. What you described was a cold boot issue, so it sounds like you would need to turn it off and let is it for a while. Warm boot issues to exist, which are the opposite, generally fails to POST on a restart. No harm in booting it 10-20 times to test.

Tom_CAT

@TSMikeW
Alright, so here is the feedback.   It's not a perfect test.   But I can confirm that the computer had no issues with restarts (stable) while the RAM was set to 2400 MHz.   After that, I turned back on the XMP/DOCP I was able to recreate the issue on a cold boot at around the 15th restart (It takes a while).   The MOBO does hang on DRAM with an Orange light.   I'll see if I can find time to just restart the thing 10 - 15 times in row today to confirm it only occurs on cold reboots, but it seems the issue is with the RAM.
Thoughts?

TSPhillipT

It could be the RAM or Processor as well as the processor is what manages the RAM.  Have you tried doing single stick of RAM at XMP?  If it crashes on both sticks when it is in one at a time, it is likely a  processor issues than a RAM issue.

Tom_CAT

@TSPhillipT
How would I test a single stick of RAM, would I need to take it out or just turn off in BIOS?

TSPhillipT

@Tom_CAT

Turn off the computer and switch the Power Supply Off, take out one stick of RAM, and do what you were doing like normal to test.  If everything works fine, swap out the RAM.  Make sure you are in XMP.  

Tom_CAT

@TSMikeW
 @TSPhillipT
Well, I have confirmed that the issue only shows up on a cold reboot.  Therefore, testing it out with different sticks of ram will take some time.   I'll come back when I can and try to restart the computer after letting it rest for a half hour to see if I can replicate.
It occurs about 1 in 10 cold reboots.
Thanks

PowerSpec_MikeW

@Tom_CAT

Issue is with your RAM. From this point we can tweak the settings to resolve the issue and maximize performance or we can replace the RAM in store for you.

Tom_CAT

@TSMikeW
Thank you for clarifying.  Let's try to tweak the settings, if that doesn't work getting it replaced would be pretty straight forward.  I just took one stick out - Per Phillip's advice - and was able to replicate the issue on the first reboot.   What settings should I adjust?

Tom_CAT

@TSMikeW
Actually, if it's easier to just get new RAM, I'll take it into Microcenter and do that.    It's pretty difficult to test for this as I have to wait to get 10 or 15 cold reboots to see if the issue is still there   Your advice?

PowerSpec_MikeW

@Tom_CAT

The RAM is a guess at this point. There are other possible causes, like the IMC on the CPU that could be the culprit as well. We'll need to replace one component to rule out the other. I would advise bringing the system in for service. We'll look into and take care of the problem.

Tom_CAT

Hey @TSMikeW - Just as an update, I took the machine in and they ended up needing to put a new processor in.   Runs beautifully now with no issues at boot or from sleep.    Appreciate all the help!!!

TSTonyV

Tom_CAT said:

Hey @TSMikeW - Just as an update, I took the machine in and they ended up needing to put a new processor in.   Runs beautifully now with no issues at boot or from sleep.    Appreciate all the help!!!

Thank you for the update on this! Glad we could be of assistance, please reach out again if you ever need anything else. 

DWeith

I have the same issue with my RAM so I checked the ASUS RAM QVL and NEO FORZA is not listed at 3200 only at 3000 using module 

NFMUD416E8-3000DH2A.

I would think using qualified RAM when advertising 3200 speed in a gaming rig would be extremely important.  Why is Micro Center installing unqualified components? 

I also updated the BIOS to the latest stable version 2802 10-23-2020 as of today 11-14-2020 which lists better RAM compatibility as an enhancement in this version.  On Auto it only runs at 2400 not 3200 and one of the memory sticks is so marginal the machine will not even POST if set to 3200 when installed.

TSTonyV

DWeith said:

I have the same issue with my RAM so I checked the ASUS RAM QVL and NEO FORZA is not listed at 3200 only at 3000 using module 

NFMUD416E8-3000DH2A.

I would think using qualified RAM when advertising 3200 speed in a gaming rig would be extremely important.  Why is Micro Center installing unqualified components? 

I also updated the BIOS to the latest stable version 2802 10-23-2020 as of today 11-14-2020 which lists better RAM compatibility as an enhancement in this version.  On Auto it only runs at 2400 not 3200 and one of the memory sticks is so marginal the machine will not even POST if set to 3200 when installed.

The QVL list doesn't mean "Only the RAM on this list is compatible and everything else won't work" it just means "RAM on this list has been specifically tested by the manufacturer for compatibility." If a particular kit of RAM isn't on the list it might not be compatible, but that's usually a non-issue. First and second generation Ryzen CPUs were known to be picky with RAM, but the improvements made to the memory controllers in the third gen pretty much eliminated those problems. Potential BIOS issues notwithstanding of course. 

We do extensive testing when designing new powerspecs and we wouldn't put RAM in the systems that we did not feel would run properly. That said, that doesn't mean there can never be any issues. It's entirely possible the RAM in your system has some kind of problem, or simply that the combination of your individual CPU, RAM and motherboard in that system alone doesn't want to cooperate with the XMP profile enabled. Unfortunately at the end of the day we're still at the mercy of the silicon lottery and not all processors/board/RAM are made equal, even if they're the exact same model. You could build a system identical somebody else's, but when you turn on XMP yours doesn't boot while theirs is perfectly fine. 

That said, I still think it's more likely that it's just the RAM in your particular system might have a problem, since the way you're describing it sounds like one of the modules is fine, and the other is not. If you haven't already, I'd also recommend testing each stick by itself in each slot to see if maybe it's a motherboard/slot related problem. 

It's also possible you have a faulty memory controller on the CPU. 

You are always welcome to bring it back to your local store's service desk for evaluation if you would like.